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Welcome everyone to the life on purpose podcast. I could not be, Oh my gosh. I'm just Beyond thrilled fangirling over Jennifer Dukes Lee. She's my guest this morning. I'm so excited to have you. I especially appreciate the fact that she is not a hundred percent. I think we've all been fighting something at some point, but she still was kind enough to get on this morning.
So welcome. Thank you. I hope my voice is clear for everybody today. If I start losing my voice, we'll know that I've pushed it a little too far today. I don't know what it is. I had mentioned to her before we hit record that I was struggling with almost like this laryngitis. I don't know. I think it's just the time of year.
I don't know what part of the country you're on that's listening, but whether you're getting hammered with snow, cold, whatever, it seems like somebody is fighting something somewhere. But anyway, all that to say, I'm thrilled to have you on today. One of the things that really drew me, over the years, All of your messaging, but certainly in the past [00:01:00] to leading up to the holiday seasons, that's really spoken to me personally is the idea and this messaging you started with, let it slow and it was around the Christmas time and it was very, just brilliant with that, but the idea of rest.
And so one of the things for my audience that I really wanted to tap into for 2025 is. Maybe taking a pause on the idea of more resolutions and investing in some restoration. And I think you do a really wonderful job at sharing that messaging. So first I just want to ask you, was it something that you were personally dealing with, or was it just things that you were hearing from other women in the industry?
Where you felt like it was important to share the messaging of slowing down. The message of slowing down is the message of my heart and it really has been for many years. And I wrote a book about it in 2021 called growing slow. I could have [00:02:00] more easily written a book called growing fast because that was the way that I rolled.
I was a woman who was always in a hurry feeling like I had to, say yes to a lot of people and get a lot of done. I probably put A lot of my work, worth and identity into productivity felt like I had to be the most responsible person in the room, a control freak, just all of those things.
And over the years, God really slowed me down and. Which is something of a miracle because it goes against what feels like the core of who I am, which is a get things done kind of girl. And it was such a profoundly impactful turn for me that it felt that I had to share it in book form. And that's mainly the event the message that I.
I am asked to present at events around the country, and it is a core piece [00:03:00] of my messaging online. So Amy, when you saw that, let it slow, you mentioned that here at the beginning around the holiday time, that was really a turn of the phrase. We all know the song, let it snow. And in my thinking in the holiday season was to bring that message of growing slow and slowing down to a very busy and.
And productivity oriented time of the year, and instead of let it snow, we needed to let it slow. So yeah, and the reality is, yeah, that's my story. But ultimately, when I share things online and in books and at events, it's because somebody else Out there is probably, most of us are dealing with a sense of burnout, of pushing, of rushing, of scaling, of and hu hustle and we're just trying to figure out a way out of that.
Yeah. I totally agree. Every aspect and characteristic that you were describing describes me and I'm wondering if that was part of the reason it resonated so quickly and [00:04:00] so is that I do think that there's a lot of women in particular that feel that they do have that, just natural instinct of wanting to do and go. And I also think that there's something where we almost feel like we need to be apologetic about is that if we are able to do something and we choose not to, where we, or we feel like we should be doing something because we can, then we feel like we need to apologize or have an excuse for that.
When in fact that sometimes we just. Need to say no. And I think it's so hard. That's been such a hard transition for me, even especially in this Christian speaking world, writing world and all of that, because I think, especially for women, when we know we can do something, we should do it, but not really.
It's just something I feel like it's just something we've told ourselves, or maybe we've bought into that idea that. When in reality, just because we can doesn't mean we should, it's just we, or I was personally [00:05:00] even living the opposite of that. So I can totally relate to what you're saying and especially the control things and all of that, that takes a lot of energy and a lot of pressure.
And so laying anything down feels awkward. It did for me, but it has been really a life giving transition. And so that's why I. I have been really focusing on trading resolutions, more things for more of like a. Restoration, so to speak. I love that. I think that a lot of us by now, depending on when this airs, Amy, a lot of us may have made resolutions and already are feeling disappointed and feeling perhaps a bit of shame because we didn't follow through.
Studies show that within. Usually two to three weeks, most people are already quote, failing their resolution. And I think the problem there is that it is on resolutions instead of, as you say, [00:06:00] restoration, like suddenly with the flip of a calendar, we think we're going to Walk 10, 000 steps a day.
We're going to read the Bible in a year. We're going to drink a gallon of water a day and all these things, and, we make these big plans, especially people like you and I, who like to get things done. And it can, and instead, I think that what I really encourage people to do is to think of one habit, like something that I can do today and build on that tomorrow.
And when I get that one established, so let's say it's I want to read the Bible every day. All right, we got that. Now let's stack a habit on top of that. Let's get started. Instead of going for the third cup of coffee, maybe start drinking water or, like you just stack it up instead of making it all about the new year.
And I think then you feel less pressure and you feel more the restoration of doing the kinds of things that God is speaking to you about that. That could happen on [00:07:00] July 15th as well as they would on January 1st. There's nothing really magical about the turn of the calendar. I totally agree.
It's funny. And I think that there is something to be said that we don't often speak or hear about the slow build. There is something to that. I agree. Just like taking one thing and replacing it. It's funny because I had mentioned before we hit record for anyone listening that I am actually away at the moment.
I wasn't planning this trip. It was something that my husband surprised me with. It's the first time we've been away as adults without our children for almost 30 years. And it's been an exciting time, but it's funny that when you're talking about this, because we're walking on the beach and my husband's slow down.
Why are you? Fucking so fast. And even in just like the minute things, I'm like, okay, I'm just trying to get my steps in and I'm trying to, you're trying to do this and trying to do that. And it's it's okay to just slow it down. And I think one of the other messages to that, and I would love your perspective on this as [00:08:00] well is the idea of slowing down and having it be a resource.
To really focus on the things that matter most, I think a lot of times for me personally, when you are on that fast track and I should be doing this and let me do this and I'll sign up for this speaking thing and let me write for this person and all of these things, I was losing a lot of my focus on what am I?
What did God call me here for? I, you're trying to fit in so many other boxes. Oh she's doing this really successfully. I should be doing that. Or maybe I should be doing more of this. And then it was like did God even call me to be doing that? I think also with the rush, we lose our sense of focus and why God has us.
And sometimes you don't have the ability to see it. So we'd love for you to speak into that a little bit in your experience. And I hate to always throw social media under the bus because I actually really love social media. I think it's a great platform to encourage other people and [00:09:00] see what's going on in people's lives and celebrate the good things that are happening in their lives.
But I think what happens is that we see, you mentioned the woman over here doing this and the woman over here during doing this. So for that looks a certain way for us as speakers and writers, but for the everyday woman, which we are also that here's this woman who has the house that looks like it's straight out of a magazine.
And you could make a whole Pinterest board off of her house. And then over here is this woman who is training for a marathon. And then over here is a woman who's telling you how you need to eat and she's making. beautifully plated food. And then over here is the woman who's taking vacations every two, two months.
And then over here is this person, this parent, that's got the perfect kids. So we take all of those women, all five of those, and we layer them up on top of each other. So instead of being one person, we're now trying to figure out how to be five. And then that. That puts us in such a [00:10:00] rush in figuring out what is important to me?
Is it, I want, I need to take more vacations or, improve my marriage and do things with my spouse? Or is it, I really love creating a home that looks beautiful and I want to be the hostess and be hospitable to friends and family? Pick the thing and that you do well and that you enjoy instead of feeling the pressure to be all five of those women.
So for you and I, Amy, in the writing and the speaking world, it can feel like I've got to be on social media every day. I need to do at least 20 events out in the world. I've got to publish a book every year or two, and it's just not possible. It's just not possible. So for me the answer to some of that is when requests come in or when I try to put things on myself, instead of saying, Oh, I can't do that.
I say, Oh, I don't do that. Like I, that's not Oh, I don't work on Sundays or no, I don't take on more than 10 speaking events a year instead of I can't, [00:11:00] when you say, are, when you say I don't. It's a boundary that you have set for yourself and decided this is good. This is healthy for me.
I can do those things. I can do 20 speaking events a year. I can try to be all five of those women, but you know what? I don't. And I won't. And that's so empowering for me. There's so much freedom in that. I love that perspective. I think that takes so much ownership also, and. It lets you stay in your lane.
You're, it gives you, yeah, I love that. I had to write it down. So for anybody watching me draw over here I think that's genius. I think that there's a, we forget. That we do have the power and authority to tap into what is good and what is healthy. And the other thing that I think is important that we lose sight of is that not only sometimes do we lose our focus, but I think when we do that, [00:12:00] when we're stacking, like you said, and I think that's also a great visual because I think a lot of times you don't recognize it when you're doing it.
So that visual that you just gave. for anybody even listening, they can appreciate that. It's wow, I wasn't realizing how much I'm really putting on myself to try to be something or someone else or, success wise or however that looks. We forget how much that we can just Become burned out when we're trying to do that instead of just honing in on, okay.
Like you said, we're a slow build. Let's replace this habit for maybe this, maybe the second cup of coffee for a glass of water, small things, but at the end of the day, maybe even jotting down instead of resolutions on where I always attribute, and I shouldn't do this, but I always. Assume when people are talking resolutions personally, it's always something where I feel like there's a [00:13:00] little bit of a financial gain or some type of gain in some way that isn't necessarily always personal, where it's affecting your either mental health or something like that, or relational and those kinds of things.
So I always think that. If we could just write down getting back to those things, like you were talking about, Jennifer, instead of just trying to be all these other women or accomplish all the, all of these other things is to say, like you said, where do I really need the growth in 2025? And then start from there.
I had just shared that, this is a trip. My husband and I have been on we haven't been on a trip alone since our honeymoon. No, that's been an intentional decision. We love always taking our kids with us. We have four children and that was a, but we needed it. So for 2025, some of my big goals don't have anything to do with.
Speaking engagements and this and that it has to do with a relational goal. And I think that those need to be weighted [00:14:00] just as important. And I know people still need to put food on the table and I'm not saying, just don't do anything that you don't need to do, but I think we need to have those be weighted just as much as some of these other things where we're serving others, I think that.
I know that it's just an old expression. You can't pour from an empty cup, but there is something to be said for that when we're talking about the idea of restoration. And so that's what I'm seeing a lot of. I shared with you before I gotten some feedback on women that just feel. Depleted.
And I think that's partly why is that they lose the focus and they lose of where to go. And maybe it's because they just haven't taken the time to decide. Where do I need to be restored right now? And then expand from there with these small, slow builds. I'm in my 50s now and it seems once I hit that 50 mark, I just had this just awakening of, I'm not going to be here forever.
Like [00:15:00] as soon as I have that kind of awakening, it's just what matters the most? And things have a way of shifting. Now I know people who are in their 30s and 40s that have a very clear awareness and even their 20s. I feel like my girls are, they're in their 20s. I feel like they have a really great awareness of the brevity of life.
And, seeking what brings them joy and what helps make the world better in a way that my generation did not there's an idealism, which is really beautiful among that generation, and it is less about scaling. And climbing and hustling and more about wholeness and, that like the word chasing after your dreams, like that's not even a way they describe things, right?
It's just, I feel like there's just such a purity to it. And some people might say, oh, that's naivete, it's, they're being naive about the reality of the world, but I find something really [00:16:00] beautiful. In that younger generation and now that I'm almost 53 I just, I really am taking stock of life and realizing what matters most and it's the people in the room.
It's my faith. It's what, how can I encourage people in the world? How can I? Enjoy the blessings of people. You hear what people say on their deathbeds. There's been a lot of studies about that. And it was not related to the time they spent at the office. It was, it's related to the relationships they had.
If we're going to resolve to do anything, may we resolve to build and enjoy relationship. I think that's that there's so much restoration that comes in just being present with other people that you love, that are safe, that remind you that you're safe and that love you back. Yeah. That's so interesting that you pointed out the younger generation, having [00:17:00] four of my own and I have.
26 down to she's almost 19, but I do see the same perspective that they have. And I do appreciate it because I do think that I grew up and in no fault to my parents or anything, but it was, it's a different perspective. And I notice a lot of times that they. Are a lot more present minus the social media, and those distractions, but in general, they're more present in what's going on around them.
There's more of an awareness where I feel like for me as a young adult, when you are trying to make. Good connections and whatever you're doing. There was a difference and I had to discover this. And also, I don't know what it is, Jennifer, about turning 50, but I'm 53. And so I feel like there is a switch that turns many different levels, but I know where also that kind of flips.
But I know when I was younger, my younger self is [00:18:00] that I could, there was, you were, I was so interested in being in, a room with certain people, but Later, I realized, but who out of that room was really in my corner and do I want to keep investing in spaces where it really didn't make sense just to be there, just to have them feeling like they were filling a void in me or in, and, instead of the relationships that actually were.
Life giving because I always use like the expressions, is it life giving or is it life draining? And those were two things that I had to really start peeling back and then focusing on, okay, these are the life giving people. These are the life giving experiences. And that's not to say to keep your world small and not expand beyond that.
Where are you getting filled up and where do you need to be filled up more? And so that was what really I. Had to tap into and again, it was something in that 50 range. And I don't know what that is, but I will [00:19:00] say that I appreciate it as a, cancer survivor. I feel like every day is a gift, but there is something to be said about turning 50 there.
You just feel like, okay, I'm grateful for every day that I'm here that I can. Talk to my kids that I, with my husband, he's still here, my parents, whatever the case is. And so how can I be more intentional about showing that gratitude and appreciation for it? I really appreciate that perspective as well.
Yeah. I think that we start attending a lot more funerals. And we are encountered with a lot more diagnoses in our own self, like you, Amy, or, we're just confronted with our own mortality a lot more and our kids are, we've got that sandwich generation, like parents who need cared for and that whose health is failing and they're, maybe like I, my dad passed away in 2022.
And then at the same time, these, Kids that you want to that you've given them what they need and your parenting changes. And I don't know, [00:20:00] it's just like this weird space. And I feel like there's so much to be learned from the older generation as they, land on the things that are most important at the end of the day, what matters and also from the younger generation.
So back to that again, Amy, I have found And there's a trend, you can Google this, but there's a trend right now where young people like in that 18 to 25 range are actually pulling back from social media, a lot of them are turning off the notifications or just pulling like Instagram off their phone.
Tick tock off their phone, like maybe for days or just like looking at it on the weekends. And I'm around a lot of, people in that age range like college or a little bit older and I feel And I'm so encouraged by their, what we can learn from them relationally. I think they're figuring it out.
And yeah, I think there's something to learn from them about [00:21:00] restoration and slowing down, and that'd be a great resolution for all of us. If you don't have to have social media, like maybe you can just turn it off for a week and then put it back on in the weekends. I don't have that luxury because my business, my ministry is really built on being on social media to encourage people a lot.
But if it's not, maybe that'd be a good, maybe that'd be a good balance for you. I think we don't even recognize. I know. I'm sure you can also attest to this at times, the time just gets away from you. You're scrolling, you're looking at one thing and the next thing, it's like an hour and a half later and you're like, what am I doing?
I have this, I need to get done. And so I do think that there is something to be said for that. And what's funny about the younger generation. And I think it's funny just because we both have children, this age group is that I think, with my children growing up, they missed, they just missed.
And I'm wondering if your daughter's the same where they didn't have a lot of electronics. We didn't allow it. There were like maybe like [00:22:00] DS games or different video games at the time, but there was nothing that was a constant. And so they really just, I feel escaped that now granted.
With the internet and Instagram and all of those things, it's a quick pickup, but I feel like because they didn't have a, to start, I will often hear my older children say, boy, I'm so glad we just missed that because it. I, when you think about it and I think about younger children growing up now, like they don't know a world without it, where I feel like my children, luckily I feel fortunate that they do have that ability to know a world without it, even though it seems long, long ago now, but, and I'm wondering too, if that's where they have the ability now to say, I do remember that and.
I think it would be nice to shut this down and start, like there, there's something to be said for that. And I think sometimes they're better about it than we are. Yeah. I think for [00:23:00] my kids, their people were getting phones already in like fifth and sixth grade. It was difficult to like, hold them off and hold them off.
But by junior high, they did have phones. And by high school they had Snapchat and there were issues. They were, being ghosted or, they left me on red. It's called, like they, somebody read it and then they didn't ever respond. So they did go through all that. But I think in my view, because they did go through that, they're pushing back against it.
And realize how unhealthy that really is. It just feels like there's this sort of a nostalgia among younger people. Like digital cameras were one of the, like the camera that, you know, like from 20 years ago, that's like a fad. It was like a really popular Christmas present this year.
There's just like wanting to go analog, even though that's a digital, just pushing back and, making sourdough and having, friends giving. There's just some really cool things that I think if we [00:24:00] really give a look at that generation, we can learn a lot about what we want to bring into our lives today.
Yeah. That's funny because both of my sons asked for the, I was showing them how to load film into a camera. Awesome. They're like, wow, you took a film class? Oh, they got a film one even. Love it. They got a, my one son got a film one and I said, I actually in high school developed photo in the, photography department. They're like, Oh, my gosh, you must be 100 years old. But anyway, all that to say, I do think that I appreciate this conversation so much. I think it's so important. And like you said, not only just gleaning from. Our parents and that generation, but also maybe we do need to do a little bit more investing in this younger generation and really pay attention to some of the things that they're maybe picking up before we are.
And having that relationship starting with that restoration and maybe we can learn from each other. I think sometimes [00:25:00] it's always they can only learn from me and this, but I don't think so. And I appreciate that you feel the same way. And I think that's made the conversation today.
Great. As far as, in addition to us talking about restoring look at the people around us. The people that we're investing in starting with our own families, right? And how can we restore each other? And I think that's a great way to begin is just, taking what works and what's been, what they've done well and what we've done well and start collaborating those things together first.
Yeah, I love that. I love spending time with with young adults. I've been interviewing them for my next book, which I can't talk too much about yet, but in the back of my book, I have guides for this particular issue I'm writing about for college girls, for professionals, for stay at home moms, for moms.
And so I've had all these focus groups and it's just been so energizing and gives me so much hope for the world and in a way that pushes back against this [00:26:00] idea that everything is going to hell in a handbasket. It's been, there's a lot of good out there. And I think if we just look enough, and that's restoration too, isn't it?
Like scanning your environment to see the good, to see the beauty, to see what God is doing in and around us, outside, in people, in relationships. If you're always in a rush, you don't have the ability to scan. And I think that's one of the important parts of this conversation today is taking the moment, the pause when we're letting it slow is to scan and pay attention and take it all in and see what's working and what's not working.
I could talk to you all day because I feel like we have so much in common not only with our age and stage, but children and all of that, but I would love to have women connect with you. I know you are writing another book and I can't talk too much about that, but where can women connect with you outside of this interview and what can they look forward to coming up?
Yeah. So I'm Jennifer Dukes [00:27:00] Lee everywhere on social media, Facebook, Instagram, all the places. And I do tend to post about once a day. short mini devotionals. I also have a website jenniferdukeslee. com and you can sign up for my email list which is where I'll be sharing once this next book releases.
And then of course you can find Growing Slow and the Growing Slow Bible Study wherever you buy your books. It's so good. I highly recommend at least while you're waiting for this new book to come out to tap into that, check it out. I think it's really important, especially right now. I 20, 25.
For me, for sure the year of restoration. And I think that is such a fantastic resource. Jennifer, thank you so much for speaking life into this conversation for all the wisdom that you have. It's truly life giving and I know it's going to be touching many women today. So thank you. I appreciate you getting on sick [00:28:00] and and your time.
Thank you. It's been fun to be here. I'm just going to hit record. Okay.
